Law Talk Episode 12: Criminal Traffic Offenses

In this episode of Law Talk, Jonathan and Andrew explore the basics of reckless driving and other criminal driving charges in Virginia.

In this episode of Law Talk we cover several criminal traffic offenses such as Reckless DrivingHit and Run, and Driving Without a License.

Andrew Michael: All right, welcome back to Law Talk. It is Wednesday morning again, 11:05 so we’re a little bit late but it’s all good. I’m here today with Jonathan, wonderful, wonderful Jonathan. You want to say anything, introduce yourself?

Jonathan Jordan: Hello, I’m Jonathan Jordan. I’m one of the partners here at Tingen & Williams. I work in criminal defense and domestic relations so I guess we’re here today to talk about some traffic issues, right?

Andrew Michael: Yeah. What we’re talking about today is sort of like the cool intersection between traffic law and actual criminal law. We’re talking about reckless driving, hit and runs, driving without a license, that sort of thing.

Andrew Michael: I guess we can start with reckless driving. What is reckless driving in Virginia? Just lay out the basics, what are we looking at today?

Jonathan Jordan: Reckless driving, there’s a lot of ways you can do reckless driving in Virginia. They’ve made the criminal law pretty, and it is a crime. It’s under the driving code, it’s under the 46.2 part of the Virginia code. But really what the General Assembly has done, they’ve made it a crime. And basically there’s reckless driving generally which is driving in a manner that’s just unsafe or reckless disregard for other people’s safety or whatever, right? And that’s open to interpretation.

Andrew Michael: That’s just driving like an idiot basically?

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah.

Andrew Michael: Like going all over the road.

Jonathan Jordan: It’s something, it’s more aggravated than simple speeding or the regular things.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: It’s something more, like just [dangerous 00:02:07].

Andrew Michael: So actually I saw someone that would probably count under that on Monday. I commute to work every morning. And there was this guy who passed someone going like 80 miles an hour on the shoulder. Like they went around on the right side on the shoulder, the rumble strips and everything. I was just sort of sitting there watching them, like oh my god.

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah, I think that counts as reckless both ways.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: Because passing, was it on the right or left, I don’t-[crosstalk 00:02:34].

Andrew Michael: Right.

Jonathan Jordan: … It matters. You’re not supposed to pass on the right anyway. Passing on the shoulder, you’re not supposed to do that. Then going 80, you’re not supposed to do that either, so.

Andrew Michael: Yeah, because speeding can be reckless driving as well, at certain thresholds.

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah. The other way to do reckless driving, it’s more specific, but it’s reckless by speed.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: So basically there’s two ways to do that in Virginia. Anything 20 over the limit is reckless driving. But whatever the speed limit is if you cross the threshold of 20 you are reckless driving that you can be charged with a crime. That’s a Class One misdemeanor.

Andrew Michael: Okay, so if I’m going like, if there’s a school zone, not even a school zone. If I’m in a residential area, the speed limit’s 25 and I’m going 46.

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah, that’s over 20 over the limit so that’s 21 and officer, if they caught you, or if somebody else reported you, you could potentially be charged with reckless driving.

Andrew Michael: Okay.

Jonathan Jordan: And the other way to get reckless driving is just a simple, anything, as of now in Virginia, anything over 80 miles an hour is automatically reckless driving. Even, there’s some places in Virginia on the interstate I’ve seen where the speed limit’s 70, so really you could be reckless driving going 10 over the limit or 11 I guess [crosstalk 00:03:44]

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: … Reckless driving.

Andrew Michael: And this is really common, especially like going from Richmond to D.C. That whole corridor is-

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah. Northern Virginia, they really move up there. So at any given moment unless you’re stuck in traffic half the interstate are potentially driving recklessly.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: They really move, I think they’re going about 85 or so up there, that’s pretty typical.

Andrew Michael: Oh yeah. We talked about the different, what reckless driving is. What differentiates it from speeding or improper driving in the Virginia code? Because speeding it’s just, it happens. It’s super common. But what makes it go into the reckless? Is it the 20 miles, is it-

Jonathan Jordan: Well, reckless, it’s defined by statute. Reckless by speed is defined by statute, anything over 20 miles over the posted speed limit is reckless. Anything over 80 regardless of the speed limit is reckless. That’s a pretty clear bright line. As soon as you do one of those two things you’re reckless.

Jonathan Jordan: The other way to do reckless is unsafe driving basically, endangering other motorists or yourself or whatever. That reckless, I didn’t pull up the statute. I wish I had it here so I could recite it to you very quickly. It’s basically making, it’s being unsafe in a way that’s above and beyond the normal regular unsafe. You asked how does that compare to speed? Well we can have reckless by speed.

Andrew Michael: Okay.

Jonathan Jordan: But you could go reckless while driving the speed limit for example if you passed in a no passing zone. There’s rules already against, rules that say you have stay within the lines and that tell you where you can pass. But if it’s done in such a way that it’s especially dangerous you can be charged with reckless anyway.

Andrew Michael: Mm-hmm (affirmative). I guess what I was trying to get more at is the improper driving definition.

Jonathan Jordan: Improper driving is weird. You’ll never be charged with improper driving. Police don’t write that, that’s not a crime that police can charge you with. That’s more of a way to mitigate a reckless driving charge. The Commonwealth Attorney, we call our prosecutors Commonwealth Attorneys.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: The Commonwealth Attorney can say you know what, I’m going to lower that and do you a favor. I’ll lower that. I’ll reduce the charge from reckless to improper. Or a judge can do the same thing, [crosstalk 00:06:07]. You know what I heard the evidence … Let’s say you’re in an accident.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: This is a fairly common situation. There’s a rear end accident. Someone hits someone else. The police arrive at the scene and they say, “You know what that could be maybe following too closely. That could be failure to obey a traffic light. Maybe speed was involved.” They have lots of contributing factors and they could probably cite any one of these or a number of them. But they look at it and say, “You know, taken as a whole I think that’s probably reckless.”

Andrew Michael: Okay.

Jonathan Jordan: And they charge reckless. But you go to court and you’re telling your story to the judge and you’re putting your case on. The judge says, “You know what, I don’t think that’s quite reckless,” or “I’m really busy on my docket today and I want to speed this along.” And they reduce it down to improper.

Andrew Michael: Okay.

Jonathan Jordan: So you’ll never be charged with reckless but improper is a lesser included offense of reckless and it’s not a crime.

Andrew Michael: Yeah. That’s what I was really trying to get.

Jonathan Jordan: That’s the key thing. Improper driving is not a crime so if you can get a reckless down to an improper, I mean depending on the circumstances, that’s a pretty good deal.

Andrew Michael: Yeah, because reckless driving itself is a, what class misdemeanor is it again?

Jonathan Jordan: It’s a Class One.

Andrew Michael: It’s a Class One, so it’s the most serious.

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah, it’s the most serious misdemeanor. Anything above that you’re moving into felonies. But a Class One misdemeanor here in Virginia is punishable by up to 12 months in jail and/or a fine of- [crosstalk 00:07:25]

Andrew Michael: A huge fine.

Jonathan Jordan: … Yeah $2500. It’s pretty serious. And more than that, if you have security clearance. We have a lot of, especially in Northern Virginia, D.C. stuff, you have government contractors or employees and this is a crime. You could potentially lose security clearance.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: You could get, or show up on all your job applications. In Virginia there’s no current way to expunge a proper criminal conviction.

Andrew Michael: Which is why the improper driving is so important because you’re basically lowering your sentence from a misdemeanor, an actual crime that shows up on your record, to sort of a traffic court-

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah, it’s an infraction. It’s an infraction. It doesn’t really, it’s not a crime. Infractions are defined as non-crime.

Andrew Michael: Okay. One last thing on this note just because we’re already at like 13 minutes for this, what about out of state drivers? Let’s say I’m driving from North Carolina, I’m going up to visit my parents in Maryland or something. And I got caught for reckless driving somewhere along the line. How do I deal with this? Like what can I do to mitigate it, just sort of talk me through the steps.

Jonathan Jordan: Well, it’s the same as anybody else. With reckless driving you’re required to make an appearance in court.

Andrew Michael: Yeah. In the court that you were charged in?

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah. Potentially you can make a deal where if … Here’s the thing with crimes in Virginia. If there’s jail time and if the prosecution is going after active jail time they require the defendant, the accused, to be physically present.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.[inaudible 00:09:00]

Jonathan Jordan: If it’s a, are we good?

Andrew Michael: Yeah, they’re just, these stupid cameras are being dumb. Anyway, yeah, keep going.

Jonathan Jordan: IF they’re going after active jail time the defendant has to be physically present. They will not hold the trial without them. If they’re not going after active jail time or jail time, if they’re going after just say some sort of fine then the defendant doesn’t have to be physically present.

Jonathan Jordan: So it’s a good idea to immediately hire an attorney. The attorney can go to court on your behalf and maybe at minimum get the sentence if not the charge itself reduced. Get the sentence reduced so it’s not active jail time.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: The question is … So that’s a crime in Virginia. The question is is in the home state how does your state treat reckless driving [crosstalk 00:09:40] a similar kind of charge.

Andrew Michael: That compact right?

Jonathan Jordan: In some states I’d imagine reckless driving is not a crime potentially, I don’t know. I don’t know the law in other states. But if it’s not a crime in another state you’re more concerned about how your state treats reckless driving than how Virginia would treat it if you don’t live in Virginia. But typically it’s a good idea not to get convicted of crimes anywhere.

Andrew Michael: I mean, yeah, that’s pretty good advice.

Jonathan Jordan: My advice is if you’re charged with reckless driving, this is serious. A lot of people say oh I’ll just go pay a fine.

Andrew Michael: No, it’s not traffic.

Jonathan Jordan: To me it’s not worth the risk. It’s not. It’s a car, it’s a vehicle violation but it’s not an infraction. It’s not a traffic thing. It’s a criminal thing. You could actually go to jail for 12 months.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: I mean the maximum sentence is uncommon but the stakes are high and it’s not something you want to mess around with.

Andrew Michael: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Jonathan Jordan: You want to put your best case forward and get, either straight up fight the charges or get it reduced. At least, at minimum, get some sort of penalty reduced.

Andrew Michael: Yeah, because it’s a Class One misdemeanor. This is the same category as, isn’t assault and battery in this class of misdemeanor?

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah, assault and misdemeanor. This is-

Andrew Michael: It’s serious, big stuff.

Jonathan Jordan: It’s not a violent, obviously reckless driving is probably not a violent crime and they show up differently depending on what’s going on but it’s the same penalty.

Andrew Michael: Yeah, yeah. So let’s move on to hit and run stuff, more traffic crime crimes. Let’s start with responsibilities for drivers in Virginia after an accident. Like I get in a fender bender on my way to the store, what do I have to do? What are things that I am required by law to do?

Jonathan Jordan: Basically Virginia has what we call the stop and give aid kind of statute. You’re not allowed to leave the scene of an accident if you’re a party or someone involved.

Andrew Michael: Yeah. No matter how serious it is.

Jonathan Jordan: Witnesses don’t have any obligation typically.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: Like someone aside, an outside person does not have any responsibility, but a driver, doesn’t matter who’s at fault, a driver is obligated to stop and lend aid if possible.

Andrew Michael: With the passengers?

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah. Well we’ll get to passengers in a second.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: But the drivers are required to stop and lend aid. We’re not talking about who’s at fault. I had a case one time where a motorcycle hit a lady. It was the motorcyclist’s fault. And she was like idiot, why did you hit me, and she drove off. And she was later, they chased her down and charged her with hit and run. She’s like I didn’t hit anybody. It doesn’t matter. She’s required, because really the charge isn’t hit and run-

Andrew Michael: It’s leaving the scene of an accident.

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah. It’s leaving the scene of an accident.

Andrew Michael: Okay.

Jonathan Jordan: So the driver’s required to stop regardless of who’s at fault, both drivers, Stop, lend medical aid if needed, call the police, call 911, get an ambulance if possible. And if those aren’t viable options, maybe transport the person to a clinic. You have to save life, saving life is the first step.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: The next step is you’re required to exchange information with the other person if that person is capable of understanding you. Obviously if it’s a serious accident it’s probably not a good idea to start exchanging information right then. I mean you need to get medical treatment. But you’re required to, if you can’t do that, you’re required to contact local authorities or the state police and give your information that way.

Jonathan Jordan: You’re required to stop, lend aid, and exchange your information within, I think it’s 24 hours.

Andrew Michael: Yeah. So is it call the police and exchange your information with the other driver or?

Jonathan Jordan: No, it’s one or the other.

Andrew Michael: One or the other, okay.

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah, it’s one or the other.

Andrew Michael: All right.

Jonathan Jordan: There has to be a record of who was involved.

Andrew Michael: Okay.

Jonathan Jordan: And failure to do that is also, oh shoot, I think it’s a Class Five felony. There’s lines about when, how much damage is caused and how these things are [charged 00:13:42]. What we commonly call hit and run is very, very serious. We talked about misdemeanors before but once we get into the felony range, you’re talking about I think it’s a one to five year prison sentence.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: If I’m not mistaken on the Class Five felony.

Andrew Michael: I’m looking at it right now. It’s a Class Six felony if there’s an accident or a death. Anything else is a Class One misdemeanor.

Jonathan Jordan: That one’s a Class, there’s one of them that’s a Class Five felony and now I can’t remember which one it is.

Andrew Michael: I think that’s, oh I have it right here.

Jonathan Jordan: Anyway, what the point is is we’re in the felony range.

Andrew Michael: Yeah, this is-

Jonathan Jordan: Felony in Virginia is basically anything that includes a prison sentence more than a year. You’re moving from jails into prison.

Andrew Michael: Yeah. Here it is. Felony leaving the scene of an accident, driver, is the most serious hit and run charge and it’s a Class Five felony.

Jonathan Jordan: Oh. I mean sometimes if the damage is very minimal and nobody was hurt the police have the option of charging it as a misdemeanor, a Class One misdemeanor.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: Which would be a big deal. I mean misdemeanor is not as bad as a felony.

Andrew Michael: Yeah, definitely.

Jonathan Jordan: The point is that I don’t know that the average person would need to know the details before hand but they should understand that this is a very serious issue. And you need to stop, lend aid, and exchange information or give it to the police within a day or less than a day.

Andrew Michael: A day. The basics are then if you get in an accident, no matter how serious it is, fender bender to like actual serious cars rolling everywhere, you have to stop, you have to exchange information or inform the police, and provide medical aid. It’s like the basics of it.

Jonathan Jordan: It is essentially. And sometimes there’s a, you have an unattended vehicle, you hit a parked car.

Andrew Michael: Yeah, what if you hit property, what if I crash into a tree on someone’s yard?

Jonathan Jordan: Unattended property, you’re still required to stop, and obviously you’re not going to lend aid to a tree.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: But you’re going to still need to try to ascertain who’s the owner, right? Who owns this tree, who owns this car, who owns whatever the sense. And if you can’t do that you still need to contact local authorities and exchange your information.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: And the laws are a little bit more lax. If you didn’t hurt somebody usually it can be reduced from a felony a lot easier if-

Andrew Michael: Yeah, yeah. I think I was looking at the code earlier-

Jonathan Jordan: … It’s a misdemeanor.

Andrew Michael: … And it said you have to like try for half an hour to notify the person if it’s property. And then after that you just sort of notify the police.

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah. You just try to do the right thing.

Andrew Michael: It’s just common sense. Yeah, just common sense.

Jonathan Jordan: Do the right thing, try to make, oh I hit your whatever.

Andrew Michael: Okay. So let’s talk about passengers because I know we mentioned it earlier. What are the responsibilities, if I’m in the passenger seat and the driver hits someone what are my responsibilities, what do I do?

Jonathan Jordan: This is a weird one. Most people wouldn’t think this. Passengers in Virginia, any passenger over 16 years old in Virginia is also obligated to insure that there’s an exchange of information. If you’re riding with your mom for example, and your mom crashes somebody and then leaves, that passenger is now obligated legally to report her mom essentially.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: Otherwise the passenger can be charged with a crime as well.

Andrew Michael: Okay.

Jonathan Jordan: And I’m trying to remember, I think it can be as high as a Class Six felony if there was somebody who was seriously hurt. And if it wasn’t too bad I think [inaudible 00:17:07] a Class One misdemeanor.

Andrew Michael: I think I have it right here.

Jonathan Jordan: But the point is this isn’t intuitive.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: Typically you’ll say passengers are not responsible for a driver’s actions. In this case a passenger is not necessarily responsible for a driver’s actions but their mere presence in a vehicle where the driver left the scene, was in an accident, triggers a reporting requirement on passengers over 16 years old.

Andrew Michael: Yeah. It’s a Class Six felony, five years in jail, maximum, with a $2500 fine for the passenger if they leave.

Jonathan Jordan: That’s a big deal. That would be a bad way to start out, you know a 16 year old.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: You’re just starting to learn how to drive and suddenly you’re charged with a felony because you’re-

Andrew Michael: It’s a felony too. You’re losing rights. You can’t vote, you can’t have a gun. It’s serious.

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah, I mean aside from the minimum jail, I mean this is a big deal.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: Don’t mess around with that. And if does happen to you, report and get an attorney.

Andrew Michael: Yeah, get an attorney is like the basic [crosstalk 00:18:07].

Jonathan Jordan: You don’t want to show up by yourself in one of those cases.

Andrew Michael: Yeah, definitely.

Jonathan Jordan: That’s probably not a good idea.

Andrew Michael: All right, so let’s say someone is charged with one of these two driving crimes. What can happen to their license for example? Is it, like we’re transitioning into suspended and like restricted licenses, that kind of stuff.

Jonathan Jordan: Okay. The suspended license thing is kind of … I don’t know if I can, how well I’ll be able to answer things off the top of my head.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: Because there’s a whole bunch of ways you can have your license suspended or revoked.

Andrew Michael: There’s a lot, a lot of ways.

Jonathan Jordan: The typical thing … Well maybe I’ll start off with some definition. Virginia has several different classes of unlicensed driver, right?

Andrew Michael: Okay.

Jonathan Jordan: So we could say just not having a license. Driving without a license is a separate crime, also a Class One misdemeanor in Virginia.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: If that’s because you never bothered to get one or you can’t get one or-

Andrew Michael: It was taken away.

Jonathan Jordan: … Well that’s different if it was taken away. But just for whatever reason you didn’t qualify to get a license when you otherwise could have. Or maybe not, maybe you can’t or other reasons, immigration reason potentially or there’s different reasons.

Jonathan Jordan: So you never bothered getting license for whatever reason. Driving without a license is a Class One misdemeanor with you know the up to $2500 fine and 12 months in jail.

Andrew Michael: The year of jail time, yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: Then the next area is suspended license.

Andrew Michael: Okay.

Jonathan Jordan: You had a license and for whatever reason your license was taken away for a set period of time potentially.

Andrew Michael: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Jonathan Jordan: Or pending you qualifying or completing certain steps. So that would be a suspended license. It can be done by a court, it can be done administratively by the DMV. You don’t qualify for whatever or you commit a certain crime or something like that. And you say okay, you lose your license for 90 days, you lose your license for 7 days, you lose your license until you pay this-

Andrew Michael: Fine.

Jonathan Jordan: … Restitution, fine, court costs, whatever. Then the next step is is license revoked. And by the way the crime driving while we have a suspended license or a revoked license is a separate crime.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: And they’re very harsh. They’re very nasty penalties. That’s where they might come in and impound your vehicle and hold it for 90 days. They might add additional suspensions. They might revoke your license if it was suspended and you drove. In addition to the possible jail time and fine.

Jonathan Jordan: Suspended, all you have to do is comply with the requirements and you get your license back.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: It’s serious but it’s not as harsh as revocation. Having your license revoked basically is a court stepping in and saying for these reasons you can’t be trusted to get a license and we’re not even going to let you try to have a license.

Andrew Michael: Yeah, yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: The first time you can even attempt to get a license again you have to come back and get my permission.

Andrew Michael: Yeah, it’s like several years later too.

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah, it depends on the, sometimes it can be for three years or five years or somethings like that where they’re just like we’ve had it with you and we’re not even going to make you eligible to potentially get a license no matter what you do.

Andrew Michael: And it’s not always negative. Like the elderly can have their license revoked for example for like medical reasons and stuff like that.

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah, potentially you can have a revocation but the point is you can’t just [crosstalk 00:21:32] your 90 days or pay your fine-

Andrew Michael: You can’t just get it back.

Jonathan Jordan: … And you’re back. You have to go back and petition the court to undo the revocation, to reinstate your license.

Andrew Michael: And further, you have to actually reinstate your license. You have to get a new license. It’s not like they took it away and are giving it back. You have to like go and get a new one.

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah, you need to start over.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: On the license thing after your whatever, the qualifying event that caused the revocation to begin with is passed.

Andrew Michael: All right. So what are the exceptions to this rule? For example if I’m driving like a farm tractor on a road and all roads are highways in Virginia, right?

Jonathan Jordan: It depends on the definition but yeah, for vehicles, yeah.

Andrew Michael: So I’m driving a tractor down the road without my license. Does that count, is that an exception, what’s up with that?

Jonathan Jordan: If it’s actually a tractor and you’re using it for farm use it’s no big deal.

Andrew Michael: Okay.

Jonathan Jordan: You can drive. You don’t need a license to farm.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: The idea is, license is, in Virginia and I think every other state, a license is a privilege granted by the state. That’s how they call it, right? Whether you agree with that definition, it’s a privilege that the state can revoke or suspend when they feel like it. Well not, that’s not a good term, but if you don’t comply with their other requests or demands.

Andrew Michael: Okay.

Jonathan Jordan: But farming is kind of more along the right, it’s your occupation, it’s your livelihood, that’s your family’s livelihood. So they don’t want to prevent … And for example, kids, kids can drive tractors.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: 14 year olds is common in rural communities. At a certain age you’ve grown up with this equipment and you’re trusted to use it. And it turns out that not all tracts of land and farms are connected.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: So at some point you’re transitioning a tractor from the coop or the feedlot or the depot where you’re stocking up on, you’re hauling your crops or your grain or your fertilizer. You need some way to do it.

Andrew Michael: And the distinction is like you’re using it for farm use. You’re not just like commuting to school with your tractor.

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah, you’re not commuting in your tractor.

Andrew Michael: Like you can’t just drive your tractor down the highway on your way to school kind of thing. It has to be an actual farm use.

Jonathan Jordan: Then, by the way, there’s places where you can’t take a tractor at all, like interstates.

Andrew Michael: Yeah, yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: Tractors don’t belong on interstates-[crosstalk 00:23:51]

Andrew Michael: It’s another like common sense thing.

Jonathan Jordan: … Or something.

Andrew Michael: Don’t take your tractor down the 64 or something.

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah. But if it’s for legitimate farm use you don’t need a license which means you don’t have to be the licensing age and have to, it’s not required.

Andrew Michael: All right. I think I’m about out of questions. Is there anything else you want to touch on as our cameras die again, you foolish cameras.

Jonathan Jordan: I think the key thing is is some of Virginia’s laws are very tough and they’re not intuitive. Pay attention. If you’re charged with … First off, be heads up, know your speed requirements, know what reckless driving is. If you lose your license get it back as soon as possible. Be smart, things like that.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: If you get charged with a crime look at your citation or look up the law and see what your crime is.

Andrew Michael: Yeah.

Jonathan Jordan: If it’s an actual crime and not an infraction, you probably ought to get an attorney. And you ought to find one early so you can actually defend your case and discuss your options.

Andrew Michael: Yeah, and another example we were using is if you get a ticket and it says like RD on it for reckless driving that’s when you’re in serious, like get an attorney, levels.

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah, if you think you’re getting a speeding ticket and it’s really a reckless driving ticket you want to be careful.

Andrew Michael: Best advice, actually read the ticket that the police officer gives you. That seems important.

Jonathan Jordan: I think that’s a good heads up. Pay attention, know what the charges are and don’t just go in and admit guilt. You have to consider the potential damage to your life.

Andrew Michael: Yeah. All right, sounds good. I think that’s about it for this beautiful Wednesday morning. Thanks for being on the stream Jacob, or Jonathan. I am out of it. I need coffee.

Jonathan Jordan: Yeah.

Andrew Michael: Awesome. Thanks for watching everybody and I hope you have a nice rest of your week.

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